In addition to appearing on the Zelda Informer podcast every week, I try to take in a lot of other gaming podcasts. Video games are my curiosity and my passion, so the more I can listen to smart people talk about them, the better. Lately I’ve been falling behind on my listening, so I decided to start listening to a podcast every day on the drive to work. One episode that caught my attention was an episode of IGN’s Game Scoop! from a few weeks back. The title of the video in question was “Does Nintendo Get A Pass?”

 

They were referring of course to the fact that The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild was heaped with praise and perfect scores despite the open world concept in a game being done before. The question was whether the game would be looked at as fondly as if it wasn’t a Zelda game made by Nintendo. This wasn’t the first time I’d heard someone say this either; a quick tour through any video game forums will surely turn up someone echoing these sentiments. And this interested me.

 

 

Of course, my initial reaction is ‘No, Breath of the Wild deserved all of the praise it got because it’s an amazing game, not because it’s a Zelda game’, and while I still stand by that, I did stop to play devil’s advocate for a second and came away with an appreciation for why some people might feel that way.

 

There’s no doubt that Breath of the Wild was a monumental evolution for the Zelda series. But was it an evolution for video games? Not really. The open world design is nothing new to gamers and the ability to progress in the game without any linearity has been a feature for many years now. Likewise, the gameplay was nothing really groundbreaking; Link can jump and climb now, but is that really something we Zelda fans want to boast about since it took 30 years for Link to be able to pull that off?

 

I’ve seen people take issue with the occasional drops in frame rate or lag in draw distance. The open world has been accused by some of being baron and empty. The side quests are hardly anything more than trivial fetch quests. And as almost any Zelda fan will tell you, Breath of the Wild falls short in comparison to some other titles in the series when it comes to its story, its dungeons, and its bosses. And yet, not a single reviewer really cared. You don’t hear people point out these flaws when talking about the game. Why?

 

Many of the people that reviewed Breath of the Wild have said they grew up with Nintendo or loved Zelda as a kid; does this mean they’re more apt to let certain things slide in the game that a new IP might get dinged for? Does the fact that we waited so damn long for Breath of the Wild contribute to people really wanting to like it, to justify how long we had to wait for it? All of these questions have contributed to the free pass notion for some fans looking at Horizon and seeing a similar game with not so similar review scores.

 

 

It’s interesting to think about, and I can understand how someone who hasn’t played the game and looks at it might think it was overrated, but in the end, I just can’t help but disagree.

 

Maybe it’s the die-hard Zelda fan in me, but when it comes down to it, no, I don’t think Breath of the Wild got all these perfect scores and accolades simply because it was a Zelda title. I think it got them because it was am amazing adventure.

 

It didn’t gave a revolutionary concept or control system; it just took what had existed before and perfected it. It did have some frame rate issues and other glitches; what game that size doesn’t? It didn’t have an overworld spilling with people or animals; it has an overworld spilling with character and history. It didn’t have the best sidequests in the world; but it did have charming characters and a sense of fun. It didn’t have the world’s best story or bosses; it didn’t need to. The world told the story. The world was the obstacle.

 

 

I wouldn’t say Breath of the Wild is perfect. I would say almost no game is. But I think that people who accuse Zelda and Nintendo of trading on their name to get an easy ride to good review scores are missing the point of Breath of the Wild. To really understand why Breath of the Wild is so good, you need to climb that mountain and finally reach the top. You need to find an ingenious solution to a puzzle that no one ever dreamed of doing. You need to sail in the sky and look the dragon Farosh in the face as a calmly floats by you, majestic music playing and stars falling in the sky.

 

Only then will those people see that maybe Breath of the Wild isn’t the perfect game, but an experience unlike anything else.

 

Andy Spiteri is an Senior Editor and Podcaster for Zelda Informer. For more fun and shenanigans, follow him on Twitter, and be sure to check out his blog, The Alchemists Lab.
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  • Ixbran

    So for the first time since I can remember the first Zelda game to NOT have fans instantly turn on it after it’s hype died down is suddenly over rated? Everyone either loves/hates TWW for its cute style. People either adore TP for Midnas snark and growth, but hates it’s gritty setting, intense use of the bloom effect, and attempts to be ‘edgy’. People either enjoy SS for its story, or hate it for its over usage of motion controls. And people either are either entertained by HW/L by its change of pace, extra focus on combat, and the chance to play as their fab Zelda characters, or loath it for being ‘too different’ from traditional Zelda games.

    But when we finally have a game that finally has managed to be approved by the majority of fans and that love and enjoyment for it over shadows the few who conplain, it’s suddenly the game that’s over rated because ‘oh it’s Zelda the fans will love it regardless!’

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0a9730e961e8bf0fbc3c0dc3025b5275eaf571cd0451e9cd2aa58e0d2c102831.gif

    Maybe you should consider retiring from writing articles for websites. Because honestly it’s like you’re trying to start a fight for the sake of it. Also:

    http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/228/344/5a8.gif

    Any day of the week, you piece of hipster trash

    • Brad Vincent
      • Ixbran

        “im gonna spout devils advocate then use that as a flame shield to defend my self talking bad about it”

        that doesnt fly with me

        • Brad Vincent

          I don’t know. Feels like he gave it a pretty fair wrap up. Like he said, the game isn’t perfect, but there was definite merit to it, beyond just being a Zelda title.

          • Ixbran

            Again, i just its a big coincidence that the game he decides to do this with is the one Zelda game that doesn’t split the majority of fans. As i said in my first post when ever a new Zelda game comes out, and the hype dies down, half the fans still love it, and then the other half just rips into it and does nothing but talk about its problems. For once we have a Zelda game that doesn’t split the fandom in half, and suddenly because everyone likes it, its overrated? Yeah no, this article is a bunch of bull shit and feels like hes just trying to make people fight because, for once, theyre not doing it on their own.

          • David García Abril

            If you really think BotW hasn’t split opinions, you weren’t paying attention.

            Maybe not in a 50-50 split, but no other Zelda game felt like the split was that big 3 months after launch. The proportion grew over time, and honestly, everything points out that BotW will follow the same trend.

            The same for critics. As a matter of fact, there are several big YouTube videos that feature severely mixed reviews, like Super Bunnyhop, KingK or Joseph Anderson (the latter rips almost the entire game apart, except for the exploration).

          • Brad Vincent

            I get what you’re saying, but here’s the thing: the hype is dying down. Some players are starting to rip into it. This is where we are in that cycle now. Most people who intended to play it have had their time with it, and some people have decided that they didn’t love it as much, for an array of different reasons. And to my recollection, I don’t think Andy has really jumped on that bandwagon much. But it is a point that should be discussed. Not just with Zelda, but with all games. As certain companies are moving toward advancing their games and bringing them up to date with the future of gaming, it’s up to us, as fans, to decide what we will and will not stand for, and that involves discussing what changes help move a franchise forward and improve it, and what changes we feel we’re phoned in or are coming up short. That’s a fair discussion to have, even about BotW.

        • Greenbeans

          And it’s a sin to talk bad about it why?…

    • Andy Spiteri

      Dude, get a life…

      • fun times ahead

        Do you have one yourself?

  • Chris Jagucki

    Breath of the Wild deserves the high praise, not for being a really good Zelda game, but for taking what other similar games have done and raising the bar. Many Open-World games preach you can go anywhere and do anything, but few allow you to head straight to the final boss after completing the tutorial area, and have a linear story arc that you have to complete all the way just to beat the game and roll the credits. In other Open-World games, you are restricted by what you can climb, but you can climb anything in Breath of the Wild as long as the walls aren’t slick. Breath of the Wild is also one of the few games in which, other than getting off the Great Plateau and defeating the Calamity, everything in the game, even the story itself, is completely optional.

  • Christian Beach

    Personally I feel the game deserves all of the high praise because it’s an amazing adventure. Heck, if it was just called “Breath of the Wild” and had absolutely nothing related to Zelda, it would still deserve the high praise. It’s one of the best games of all time.

    • Greenbeans

      Breath of the Wild is an 80.

      Zelda: Breath of the Wild is a 97.

      Let’s stop lying to ourselves here.

      • Azuki

        Because having a different opinion is “lying to ourselves” right?

  • Squirrel on crack cocaine.

    The game is great but yes has many, MANY flaws that reviewers simply overlooked that other games have been crucified for in the past. So in some way, yes.

  • Riley Marshall

    It’s not perfect as a Zelda game. ALttP is the best Zelda in my opinion. But BotW is astounding as a video-game in general, and I think game developers will look to this game when making open world titles. Overall, I couldn’t give this game any lower than a 9.5/10. It’s no 100%, but it still great.

  • Valwin Mediaz

    Yes it did get a free pass and we all know it

  • Apex Gaming

    It definitely got a free pass.

  • Nowhere Man

    Lol that moron reviewer. Great gameplay, great story, great soundtrack. Oh shoot, 2/10 graphics? 3/10 overrated.

  • Brad Vincent

    I don’t think “free pass” is the right word for it, because it’s not like people ONLY bought the game and ONLY liked it because it’s a Zelda title. It simply had a leg up on the fanbase, as opposed to other, lesser known franchises, or if it were a brand new IP from another third party developer. However, I still think the game would have picked up steam by release, regardless of how well it was received initially. Worst case scenario, it would have been a hidden gem. The thing is, it’s a good game, and it sets itself apart from other games considered to be open world, aside from the fact that it’s Zelda. There are game mechanics and a learning curve at play that make it about much more than following a path or grinding for experience. While it may have been something of a cop out for Nintendo to have called it “open air” as a way of making it seem like it’s really something that’s never been done before, as someone who has never been able to really play many open world style games, BotW did feel much different and more enjoyable to me. Granted, I do have the undying Zelda fan bias to back my enthusiasm, but there’s a lot of Zelda games that I’ve had a hard time playing, and have given quite the critical review upon completing.

  • Yan Dawid

    The game wasn’t very good; maybe it was because it’s Zelda or because the reviews were bought, but I thought the game was really dull and uninspired.

  • Daniel Alejandro Steinhold Cab

    Tbh it is the first Zelda game that has bored me to death. And I’ve enjoyed almost every Zelda game. Yes, I was impressed by the physics, visuals and some other things but I didn’t find it empty and that it lacks the things I love in Zelda. Yes, it is true you can go anywhere (impressive I might say), but for what? If the exploration had some meaning other than “exploring for exploring sake” I would love it. Yes, you can fight mobs of enemies, discover weapons but that doesn’t really add anything​ jawdropping. I found it more rewarding to search for items and loot in Skyward Sword to improve the shield, beetle or other items. I miss the music, I miss the dungeons, the lovable characters (Mipha, Urbosa are the exception). You had tons of characters in BotW but I never found the interest of talking with them. Also, I get that it is barren because Ganon destroyed everything. But as some ZI articles have stated. That feeling of devestation has been better felt in Ocarina or Twilight for example. In the game I would climb a mountain, get to the top with no real reason so it got boring pretty fast

    • JessterK

      I miss the music, dungeons, unique bosses, towns, characters like Saria, Malon, Midna, Groose, Darunia, and yes, Navi, Tingle, Anju Kafei, heck, even the potion shop owner (him, the mask salesman, and the fisherman dance a mean robot/macarina at the end of Ocarina of Time). Very few of the BOTW characters held that same appeal.

      • Juan Gabriel Martinez Rodrique

        I expected other characters to appear besides Beetle At least 3-5 characters.

    • Zithis

      I mean I like Sidon and and Kilton, but yeah i kinda agree with everything else

  • somebodynow

    I know I have been seeing a lot of used Switches that people want to unload. “Finish BoTW” don’t need this thing any more, or “Loss interest, don’t care anymore !” The hype is burning itself out.

  • Skia1717

    To be honest, I only think the game would deserve the high praise if it WERE NOT a Zelda game. It is an amazing game to be sure, but it hardly feels like Zelda. It’s one giant fetch quest. There’s no drama, no real reason to care about any of it. The music is lacking, the characters are dull mainly because you only interact with any of them once or twice tops, and there’s not a single dungeon to be found. Not a real dungeon. Not even the castle. Heck I was able to skip the entire castle just by climbing a wall or two and bam I was fighting Ganon without having even seen one of the Lynels or Guardians. In another game series maybe that would be awesome but the Zelda I love is the Zelda that includes a build up to the final boss that makes it seem like it really matters. Even the very first Zelda did that with a huge, dramatic, surprisingly difficult final dungeon and a nigh impossible final battle for the new player (or a frustratingly intense one for the experienced player). BotW didn’t have ANY build. It had almost no story and no drama and in reality no reason to care about climbing mountains or fighting crap tons of bokoblins. Finishing this “Zelda” game was the most disappointing thing I’ve ever done in my life. It took me ten minutes to get into the castle and beat Ganon. Every other Zelda game drags out the final sequence long enough to get your heart pounding and your hands too sweaty to hold the controller. I mean, trying to escape the collapsing castle in OoT. Fighting corrupted Zelda, the beast Ganon, watching a cinematic of Midna essentially being defeated, and then fighting Ganon again on horseback and on foot in TP. Fighting hordes of enemies as you rush down to save Zelda from Ghirahim, fighting him with a completely new set of variations on his character, and then finally being challeneged by Demise in SS. Working through an amazingly challenging final dungeon to then fight three completely original incarnations of Ganon after a beautiful cinematic of character development for the Demon King himself, and then climbing the room you just battled in to take down the personage Ganondorf after one more dramatic cinematic and doing so at the side of the princess. I mean in WW you even leave your sword jammed in his head. Come on, Nintendo, what happened to this? This is what makes Zelda so gripping, not the game play or the battles or the puzzles. You can find better player features in other games and franchises. The thing that draws people back to Zelda again and again is the fact that those game qualities are beautifully married with something that speaks to the heart of the player and makes them care, and honestly whether you realize that or not it’s always been the story.

  • CruxEternal

    Well I think you are part of the under pinning problem. You can’t help, but disagree for the most shallow of reasons. Before I go further thank you for taking a moment to consider the other point of view and I’m by no means calling you shallow. But this game is overrated, your bias for exploration in the most simplest sense and love of zelda are what one you over. Thats where subjectivity took over and it became less about the quality of the product and what it achieved. I don’t think anyone who calls this game overrated would say botw is a terrible game. As a Zelda fan and someone looking at it objectively I’d say it is a great game, but it falls short and does things the series could have done 3 Zelda’s ago and still fails to deliver in areas like voice acting which I hope Nintendo doesn’t recoil. I personally hate this game and if I based my review solely on that I’d say it was garbage and skip it. A more objective review would have placed it behind horizon zero dawn and at the near top of the above average crop.

    This is also another decisive entry in the series much like wind waker or ocarina. Thankfully the art style isn’t to blame this time or the jump from 2d to 3d, but it is a reflection upon the future of the series. Even my less liked Zelda titles are still some of my favorite games. Its why I come here and deal with the rabid fanboy behavior out of love for this series. Now I feel like Zelda has gone where I can’t follow. Because I don’t enjoy this game as it focuses on an ideal and design philosophy I have never agreed with and does so in the direction that I knock more than half of open world non linear titles for being broken. As you pointed out it wasn’t as good as some past entries I’d argue many past entries were better. So because of this I try to be vocal about the game. Nintendo has turned botw into something that isn’t zelda, but trying to shoe horn Zelda into it. While lots of people love skyrim, not everyone does. Myself included. I want Zelda, not the legend of elder scrolls: Zelda. I’m not adverse to linear game play either. I feel more compelling and interesting things are done when you’re in a walled garden that slowly builds out and gives you the option of going back once you’ve learned more. Free reign in any direction just makes things boring when the same stick can be used from start to finish and is never built upon.

    So please understand what you’ve stated above really does make the point. You were bought with nostalgia and features you craved but didn’t necessarily help the game be better.

    • zelduck

      So true! I hate this game so much!

  • Stephen Richard Watson

    Note for the editor: The word is “barren.” Also, please review the difference between “its” and “it’s.” Thank you.

    • Brandon Deriso

      Yeah, lots of typos and misused words here.

  • David García Abril

    I don’t think the game had a free pass for being Zelda.

    It had a free pass because it was a Zelda game that did what a big chunk of critics wanted Zelda to become for a very long time now.

    Seriously, have we forgotten all those think pieces that asked Nintendo to take Zelda in THIS specific route since even before the game was revealed back in 2014?

    Seriously, I always remember this think piece in particular, which went insanely viral in 2012:

    http://tevisthompson.com/saving-zelda/

    Seriously, this article stuck in my memory (because it pissed me off to no end), and kept coming back to my mind while I was playing BotW. I swear, if someone told me this think piece was the actual pitch document for BotW, I would not be surprised in the slightest. Seriously, it’s like the game tries to tick EVERY SINGLE SUGGESTION IN THAT TEXT. It’s kind of uncanny!

    The only reason why I don’t think it was the actual pitch document, conspiracy theory style, is because it was far from the only think piece that demanded Nintendo this kind of change. As a matter of fact, it’s been all over the place since “Skyward Sword”, if not even earlier than that (Egoraptor anyone?).

    It’s specially telling when people said that BotW was a “back to form” game, which I find f**** disrespectful to the series’ legacy. It’s as if these people thought that Zelda only “got it right” once and has been living a mistake for 30 years, influence in the game industry made during that time be damned.

    But all had to be sacrificed in the name of oh so precious exploration, since apparently the be all, end all of Zelda. And us Zelda fans who liked the puzzle solving, boss fighting and/or story telling apparently don’t count.

    • RackShaman

      That really is uncanny, and I agree that BOTW is missing some of the characteristics that we all loved in other games, but to say story, bosses, and especially puzzle solving were sacrificed entirely seems exaggerated.

      That said, I think it would be really nice to have another Zelda with open world, but a more linear/dramatic story and more traditional dungeons. Still glad we got this game as it is, though, even if it’s not perfect.

      • David García Abril

        Well, I didn’t mean “sacrificed” in the literal sense. And I was referring more to the mentality of the critics than to Nintendo’s (the think piece I linked literally says Zelda would be better off without a story).

        The open world approach did hurt those three aspects, but as I said, I’m more concerned about the (meta) narrative than about what happened in the game, since it may make Nintendo learn the wrong lessons.

    • RiverDevil

      “It’s as if these people thought that Zelda only “got it right” once and has been living a mistake for 30 years influence in the game industry made during that time be damned.”

      Maybe not for all 30 years, but what influence has home-console Zelda had since OoT? IMO, MM was the last fresh game prior to BOTW, and while I loved all 3 subsequent home console releases prior to BOTW, none were ground breaking or were industry influencers when compared to either OoT, or contemporary competitors’ releases from the same time. I wouldn’t call any of them mistakes, but they were missed opportunities. Basically they played it safe, re-skinning OoT with new gimmicks and longer gameplay. Which is fine (I’d take basically a new OOT every year, but in such case, it shouldn’t take 3-5 years between releases). But nothing home console post-OOT did what the original LOZ, LTTP or OOT did in the industry. Not that I am saying that BOTW has the same influence or standing as LOZ or OOT, but I think it’s unfair to herald the “legacy” of these post-OOT titles so strongly when it amounted to a decision to stagnate the series. If we look at the titles pre-WW, they are all vastly different, and while there were core Zelda elements, each had a different emphasis for gameplay on the range from exploration to story, puzzle to combat, linear to open, etc. It’s only since WW has the “legacy” (which BOTW is apparently breaking) become a thing (again, limiting to home console releases)

      I think BOTW made some poor decisions on content and approach, and isn’t perfect, but the series definitely needed something fresh, even if it meant sacrificing some of the “legacy”

  • RackShaman

    BOTW made more or less aimless adventuring feel like it mattered, which is more than I can say for other open world games I’ve played (namely Skyrim). Puzzles and little secrets covered the map, and those are the things I love most about Zelda. The combat was fluid, fast paced, and fun, and the game had a lot of polish, which I appreciate (looking at you again, Skyrim).

    Arguably the most potentially lacking area is the story, or more precisely just the result of how its told. The story of the world is great and fleshes out wonderfully, but as others have pointed out, the story of beating Ganon in the present is less dramatic as in games past. Still, I don’t think the problem is as bad as some have claimed. By all means, you have the option to go through all the toil and have a dramatic buildup to the final boss fight. Just because you /can/ climb a couple walls and skip all of the buildup doesn’t mean you have to, or even /should/ if you care about the feeling of the moment.

  • TUbEStAR

    I mistakenly played Breath of the Wild before I played Horizon Zero Dawn. Link can climb virtually anything and everything in the world. Aloy can only climb certain things, and very few things at that. It made the open world in Horizon feel very linear (even though it is a great game otherwise). I mention this because I think a big part of the reason I enjoyed Breath of the Wild so much (9/10 in my opinion) is because it nailed the open world concept in a way that most other open world games hadn’t previously dared even dream of. If it weren’t a Zelda game, I feel that it would still be admired for the same reasons, but that it maybe would have been a sleeper hit. Breath of the Wild does have flaws, but it will have a lasting effect for what it did well.

  • BurningDeku

    Like, the complete opposite. I am at one point dissappointed that it’s almost nothing like a zelda game. It does so much new stuff on it’s own and it does it so damn well. That it gets 9’s and 10’s despite the poor launch peformance proofs even more how amazing the game plays.

    • Greenbeans

      The game plays particularly well when it freezes every time I hit a Moblin.

  • Biggles1071

    is it a very good game, perhaps near the best? Of course. Any game where you can immerse yourself in the world gets a high rating from me, regardless of gameplay, soundtrack, mechanics, or story. But is it a good ZELDA game? Does it have the story of OoT or TP? Is it better than MM, or have the same OMG factor as MM? Does it have the soundtrack of TP or SS? Or the gameplay of SS (sorry, I’m a huge fan of Wii motion controls). Does it have goofy chars like MC? In essence, not only is it as fun to play as all the other Zelda titles, but how quickly will I pick it up and play it again?

    I firmly agree you could have thrown any characters/races into the game and made it a great game, maybe that’s what I like least about it. It’s a big open world with Zelda thrown at it. But you could replace any of the chars with any other chars, and viola, it’s a Mario game, and you wouldn’t lose anything. Replace a shrine with a green pipe, it’s all the same.I crave more. Why is there a Moblin camp HERE of all places. Where did the skull rocks come from? Don’t create monsters wherever darts hit the map. Give us a REASON as to why monsters exist, other than to replenish our weapons stash. Heck, that rupee-stealing bird in MM at least had a reason to exist.

    And as for repeat playability? I don’t think so. The thought of re-climbing all those mountains just makes me mentally fatigued.

    But then, if you look at this from the original LoZ perspective, it’s exactly like LoZ. And if that was its purpose, it certainly achieved that.

  • Vados

    A little bit, yes. Don’t get me wrong, Breath of the Wild is by far the best open-world game I’ve ever played, but I think it got rid of too many traditional elements of this franchise. If it had the sidequests, tone and characters of majoras mask, with the dungeon quality of Skyward Sword, I think it would definitely deserve those ratings, but personally BotW is a 9 for me.

    If anything, I think BotW can serve as the perfect framework for future zelda games to build upon.

    • Greenbeans

      Dungeon quality? It had four copy paste dungeons.

      • Joe Barber

        I think he meant to say boss quality.

        • Greenbeans

          Boss…

          Dungeon…

          That’s one big typo.

          • Joe Barber

            I know, people make the funniest mistakes sometimes! XD Dude! I should like, like my own comment now, right?

          • Greenbeans

            Yes, because that’s not only relevant, but a clever and wholly original jab at my character, dirty self-upvoter that I am.

      • TUbEStAR

        He wrote “dungeon quality of Skyward Sword.”

        • Greenbeans

          You’re forgetting the “it had the…”

          • TUbEStAR

            “If it had the …”

      • Link

        Learn how to read before you reply

        • Greenbeans

          That’s going to be a problem, I don’t know how to read.

        • Greenbeans

          Learn how to punctuate before you reply.

          • Link

            You notice petty mistakes like that and you’re that bad at reading?

          • Greenbeans

            Someone’s gotta notice them since you clearly can’t.

          • Link

            And someone needs to make sure you read properly since you clearly suck at it.

  • Cameron Zvejnieks
  • Greenbeans

    Yes. The “music” was awful, the story was lacklustre and mediocre, like a last minute afterthought, any supposed difficulty is nullified by consuming your endless food supply. It was all world, no anything else. Half finished after how many delays.

    • LittleGreen

      I remember you and I discussing this game a few days after release. I see your opinion changed.

      • Greenbeans

        Nah, still a great game based on world alone.

    • Joe Barber

      I hate to fathom it, but I do agree. I wish they would make it so we can disable gliding.

      • Xyruk

        Just don’t press the X button when falling. Done, gliding is now disabled.

      • Vados

        Why would you want to disable gliding of all things ???

        • Joe Barber

          to make the game a bit more challenging. Everytime you are thinking about jumping off of something, you’ll have to think, “am I going to die?”

          • Vados

            but that doesn’t really make the game more challenging…it just makes it more tedious.

  • richa

    It does has some problems but I feel like Zelda get way harder slapped for that than other games because its Zelda.

    People be like: ohhh you see! Its not perfect! You can easly crack endless mountain climbing. “Proceeds to walk on a vertical mountain with a horse on skyrim.”

  • Joe Barber

    They delayed it for 3 freaking years to make it good. It was pretty great, but Skyward Sword had more fulfilling boss fights, and that is #1 all I care about, so it only gets a 9/10 from me.

    • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

      I would disagree. The boss fights in SS were probably the easiest in the series, and design wise I thought barely any of them approached the levels we saw in games prior. The Blight Ganons were not amazing, but they were more fun and difficult than SS.

      • Juan Gabriel Martinez Rodrique

        Play the game in legend mode.

      • Joe Barber

        Twilight Princess had the easiest bosses, that is common knowledge at this point. Believe me buddy, I know what I’m talking about.

        • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

          Scalpers was an easier and more stupid looking version of King Dodongo, Moldarach had two giant eyes to hit with your sword, Tentalus had a giant eye to hit with your bow, Kloktos was original and very cool stylistically, but ultimately “use the whip and hit him with his own sword was not very difficult, Ghirahim was annoying as balls to figure out, but easy to dodge, and the Forsaken was a waste of space I’m not even going to touch on. The only boss that felt like a good and even slightly challenging fight was Demise himself.
          Twilight Princess had relatively easy bosses, but every one had a better puzzle to it, and every one was a uniquely styled creature overflowing with character.

          • Joe Barber

            I don’t remember asking for a list of my favorite bosses, but thanks I guess. In botw, there is no need to even aim at an eye. You just shoot some bomb arrows and blam! The boss is dead. :/ In every single TP fight, you just stun it three times and it is dead. It’s always super obvious on how you kill it too. In SS there are many fun things to discover during the actual boss fight. For instance, I didn’t realize I could skydive onto the Imprisoned’s (not Forsaken) head during all of his fights, and I didn’t realize I could cut off Tentalus’s actual arms during my first playthrough, and I used arrows to take out Levias’s Parasite. In botw there is nothing to discover because you already know that you can kill anything with anything, in TP there is nothing to discover because everything has to die in one specific way, which is: Use item to expose weakspot, then hit said weakspot 3 times, repeat 3 times, boss is dead. Although some SS bosses followed this formula as well, many of the boss fights had multiple phases with bigger variations and other ways to kill the boss besides just using your item to stun it, like swinging your sword in certain arcs. Just saying, there is much more to an SS boss fight than practice with the item you received in it’s dungeon.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            “Although some SS bosses followed this formula as well.”

            SS bosses ALL followed that pattern. Admittedly, it is a pattern most Zelda games employed beginning witb Link to the Past.

            “many of the boss fights had multiple phases with bigger variations and other ways to kill the boss besides just using your item to stun it, like swinging your sword in certain arcs.”

            I argue this is the same pattern, just using your Wii Motion Plus as the key item to killing the boss rather than the key item found in the dungeon. Also, the only bosses that applies to are Moldarach and Ghirahim. In the case of Moldarach, you still have to use the dungeons key item periodically to reveal him from under the sand, so that’s still following the same pattern.

          • Joe Barber

            :-/ that’s quite an outrageous comparison to argue. It’s like saying that Link’s ability to walk is a “key item” that helps him get around the map, since the Wii Motion Plus is Link’s ability to move his arms. It’s a whole gameplay mechanic used in waaaay more than just swinging his sword in that game, you can’t even argue that it is an item! Using arguments like that, I could say that all Zelda games are exactly the same. If that were the case, we wouldn’t even be talking about this right now. The Wii Motion Plus is more of a button on the controller than an item in the game. Like an advanced version of OoT’s B button.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            That’s a fair way of putting it, but since it is in fact a mechanic that you get at the start of the game and then have to use on the first boss, why does the concept not apply to it? It serves the same function in the fight with Ghirahim as the bombs do for Scaldera, bow does for Rental is, and some other item for every other boss I the game.
            In Ovarian of Time, you get the Bow early on in the Forest Temple. It is then a key item to defeat the boss of that dungeon plus can be used to harm Morpha, and is required to defeat Bongo Bongo and Ganondorf. The same concept here applies. Just because it is with you for most/all of the game does not discount it from the purpose Zelda has been notorious for giving items.

          • Joe Barber

            No no no, it isn’t the same at all! The bow is still an item. The fact that Link can swing a sword and fly a bird, is not. It does not serve the same purpose in the Ghirahim fight, there is no stunning, it is simply the mechanic that deals him damage. It’s a boss fight, except you get rid of the stun and you can just hit him if you do it correctly. :/ You literally use the Wii Motion Plus for pretty much everything besides moving Link’s legs and talking to NPCs (which you actually can use it for). Saying you have to use it in the fight against Ghirahim is like telling me I have to press the b button to deal damage to defeat a bokoblin in BOTW. You do not stun him with an item and then proceed to deal damage. Ghirahim is not even similar to other bosses at all, because you have no use of his dungeon’s item in the fight against him.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            You have no need to use the dungeon item because they designed him with the same mechanic.
            When fighting Molgera in Wind Waker, you HAVE TO hit it with the Hookshot, then stab it repeatedly.
            When fighting Ghirahim, you HAVE TO attack correctly with the Wii Motion Plus.
            Both of these mechanics are the ONLY way to deal damage to the boss, and in this way they are identical mechanics to the respective boss fights. The length of time he has possessed any given item does not matter. I would say the same for Biggoron’s Sword in Ocarina of Time against Ganon. You NEED to hit his tail to hurt him. You can do it with the Hookshot or Giant’s Knife or Megaton Hammer, and if anything that solidifies my point even more.
            The sword is not an item in the same sense as a dungeon item, I agree. It is usually closer connected to the story, as well as Link’s go-to weapon(rather than a situationally better weapon), but in the case we are discussing, it is treated the same as a dungeon item insofar as it is the ONLY mechanic which is capable of defeating a boss.

            If this doesn’t get my point across at least, I think we’re better off giving up because we’re arguing in circles. XD

          • Joe Barber

            So in summation: You think that if anything deals lasting damage to a boss, that makes the boss fight work exactly the same (not visually, but mechanically) and the only variation is which item we use to kill it. :-/ Is that what I’m hearing?

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            Basically, yes. It’s a trope the series has used since A Link to the Past. You use item X to inflict damage upon the boss, usually by stunning it the item and then attacking it with whatever means you like, but in some cases it’s just that a certain attack or weapon is the only thing that can damage it.

          • Joe Barber

            using an attack/item/sensors-in-your-controller (we were talking about the Wii Motion Plus, not the sword earlier) to deal damage to a boss describes literally every single boss fight in every video game since the beginning of time. That’s why I think you are grouping things together way too broadly.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            The key difference between this and other games’ boss fights is that Zelda makes it a puzzle requiring a specific item. In most other games, you can freely attack the boss however you want to kill it. Take Fire Emblem, Elder Scrolls, or World of Warcraft and the puzzle is replaced by a big number of HP that must be depleted by any means. You can attack with magic, bombs, guns, boss, melee weapons or otherwise. The puzzle element in Zelda is distinctly different from most other games, and in fact was the one of the reasond you were decrying the BotW bosses. In comparison to the rest of the series, they are very light on puzzle elements and basically all they are is a wall of HP. I still think this is better than the SS boss fights because the wall of HP coupled with each one’s unique abilities makes for what I consider a more difficult boss fight because every boss in SS had the puzzle presented so obviously that you could complete it without thinking.

          • Joe Barber

            not by any means, it is still the same thing, you use strategized attacks and you press buttons to bring down a boss, it’s all the same thing with how you’ve grouped it. For instance, in skyrim you aim at the head to get an effective attack, in fire emblem you hit the boss depending on the weapon triangle and in WoW you attack based on attack immunities to find the right strategy to kill the boss. SS didn’t present it’s bosses weakspots any more blatantly than the other Zelda games did. I think WW did the best job at making the boss fight a bigger puzzle, but that’s basically the only one. BOTW? Bomb arrows with a good bow and everything is fine. Twilight princess? Well wouldn’t you know it, every dungeon gave you an item to use and every boss has a giant unnatural freaking huge eye somewhere on it, so hit that.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            The only boss with a giant eye in TO was Armogohma, whereas SS had giant eyes on Moldarach, Tentalus and Scaldera.
            I guess I have a different way of going about Skyrim than you, I just repeatedly smack stuff with a claymore until it dies. I can kind of concede that Fire Emblem uses a similar thing with the weapon trtriangle but on larger bosses it doesn’t usually apply.

          • Joe Barber

            I’m going to assume you meant to type TP. If so take a looker at these pictures of THE FIRST THREE Twilight Princess bosses:
            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/9813f6a005e22f8b9744ef22ec202ce0f7e326f4661544f6b4a5b308ec9a13a5.jpg https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/748d718c69a9883db178a8bc8217b18cd4a912b3927723299a5709b0c878baa6.jpg https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/4c111be5af6322c4601986ace89959e13c1d127f454d7be73d5179ec377f592b.jpg
            Oh look, they all have eyes. If you look closely at #3 (Goron chief monster) it is indeed, another eye. If you can get the right pause on the camera, even argorak has an eye inside of his crystal: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/b80f427d2fc2ac9222b8d27df58225d706a6a0e5e96e4662d7d8bad7aa69e79b.jpg
            All the bosses that aren’t actual story characters in the game have an eye, except for Stallord, who is actually a pretty fun and unique boss, despite being one of the easiest bosses in the entire Zelda universe to dodge.
            XD Zant’s boss fight is practically just replacing the eye in all the other boss fights with his body. Then you have a fun little duel where there is no eye, you just dodge until he gets tired and then you can hit him. Ganondorf is basically a more intense dark nut fight. If we are talking mini bosses and awesome dungeons then I am all for Twilight Princess, but for the climax at the end of a dungeon… Most of Skyward Sword’s are more of a reward and TP’s are more of a let down. “I wonder how i’m supposed to… Oh! Another eye, nevermind.” Yes, Skyward Sword has a lot of eyes, but it’s bosses take more effort to kill. I had really bad reflexes when I first started that game, so the timing with the Wii Motion Plus was actually quite difficult. I had gotten to Ghirahim the second time and I actually gave up for a week or two because I just couldn’t beat him, in the end, my brother’s got to Demise and gave up, but I was the one who finally put him down. Now I can kill most of the bosses in under 30 seconds. :/ Skyward Sword’s boss fights were more memorable to me. If SS boss fights were way too easy for you, that means you were way too good at that game to begin with. You forget how much you rely on hearts until they’re gone, I realized this when I played hero mode and it was indeed, quite a bit harder and a whole different experience. I only managed to beat it because they had included an invincibility potion (which was pretty dumb, but I was desperate, okay?). I played Hero mode on Skyward Sword and had even more fun than I’d had during my first playthrough. I died a lot fighting the early bosses that are usually really easy! But if you slip up twice, you are dead. then I played hero mode on Twilight Princess and the only time I died was when I fought skull kid… :/ I almost stopped because I was so bored, but since it was in HD the experience was good enough to finish it. Twilight Princess’ boss fights may be acceptable to you, but they are a huge let down after completing a fantastic dungeon to me.
            (also, in Fire Emblem, every unit, even the Demon King, has weapons that are good against it. There is a weapon for every situation. There are Dragon Weapons, Holy Weapons, Horse weapons, weapons to flip the triangle… etc. Heck, in some games you can make your own weapons!)
            (Skyrim does have weaknesses for bosses and enemies, but it works the same as BOTW in the sense that you don’t NEED to “hit the eye” even though it is there, you just have to hit the enemy by throwing any attack at it over and over and over and it will eventually die.)
            That’s all I got. If you have any final defenses for Twilight Princess’ bosses, I’ll read ’em. But I won’t reply unless you ask me to. It’s been fun, dude.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            For some reason your other comment is not showing up in the feed but I can see it in my email. Anyhow, pretend this is in response to the other post.

            I honestly never noticed the eyes on Argorok or Morpheel, Morpheel because the floating thingy reminded me of Morpha’s floating nucleus. I did legitimately forget Diababa, but I still think he was more interesting than any SS boss, since he had pissed off the whole forest and even the monkeys wanted revenge.
            I don’t think I ever denied that TP had easy bosses, just that those in SS were easier, and I did not think most of them had much appeal besides Moldarach. I thought in some cases that the sub bosses were even better. Like Scervo. He was a totally badass too pirate that fit the sand ship characteristically, had a great design, and made for an engaging fight. Then you get Tentalus at the end of the dungeon, a fight which is leagues easier, (I just made a sailing pun.) styled around the sea in general rather than matching the dungeon theme, (not a very interesting design either) and had the biggest eyeball in the Zelda series ever.

            So you keep thinking your opinions and I’ll keep thinking they’re incorrect, that’s how the internet works. Thanks for the engaging conversation anyways. Most people stop posting or resort to flaming after two or three replies. XD

          • Ehhh…. did you play Twilight Princess… there’s like 3 bosses you can kill in one hit or one cycle (a cycle usually refers to the process of expose the weakpoint and then unleash a flurry of attacks while incapacitated).

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=16&v=lS_AULHvmeY

            There’s also several bosses that don’t pursue and try to kill Link. Such as Fyrus and Morpheel and wander aimlessly more or less.

            Twilight Princess features the most OP Link in the series, with techniques like Finishing Blow, Mortal Draw and the Bomb Arrows as well. Making quick work of 95% of the enemies in the game. Not to mention Twilight Princess enemies do the least amount of damage out of all Zelda games. I mean bombs (and bomb arrows by extension) themselves do five times more damage than even the Master Sword.

            I also don’t consider the puzzles of the bosses to be much of a puzzle. All of the bosses are weak to the dungeon item, and that formula alone removes any puzzling element to boss battles.

            And Twilight Princess is as guilty as Skyward Sword for having “giant eye weakpoint”. I mean you have Twilit Diababa with it’s eyeball tongue that it waves in your face, you Morpheel with it’s eyeball travelling around in it’s tentacles and then moving to the back of it’s head when it starts moving around, you have Armaghoma with it’s giant eyeball in it’s abdomen.

            The simple fact that Skyward Sword has no bosses that you can kill in one hit or a single cycle automatically makes it have tougher bosses. And the fact that it doesn’t always follow the “get a dungeon item, use on boss” formula means you actually do have to think more. The Beetle you got in Skyview Temple doesn’t work on Ghirahim, oh my!!! In most cases being able to defeat a boss in Skyward Sword relies on mastery of skills, whether it’s your aim, your abilities to read the enemies movements, or timing to reflect with a shield bash.

            Skill based combat versus a “key” based combat system, where it’s simply a matter of using the right weapon they are weak to. Although most boss battles of Skyward Sword is a mixture and combo of both using the right gear at the right time, while still performing those sword strikes and shield bashes with precision.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            Sure, once you know EXACTLY how to kill a boss it’s easy. Going back and fighting the bosses again, I think there are very few from any 3D Zelda that are all that hard. The first time around, though, TP’s gave me much more trouble than SS. I only died once on my first play through of SS, and that was to Demise himself. Plus, as I said in a previous comment, the same formula to bosses applied to Ghirahim even if it was not the dungeon item. Instead it was the sword with the new motion plus ability, but the boss was still defeated by using a recently acquired ability to stun it and then beating the shit out of it. Aside from him, EVERY SS boss had the dungeon item as this weakness until Demise. Kloktos by the whip, Scaldera by the bombs, Tentalus by the bow, and the only sorta maybe exception is Moldarach, who was also stunned by motion plus, but the dungeon item (bellows) still had to be used to reveal him to fight. This process of boss design exists within both games, and more to the point, every Zelda since Link to the Past. It is in no way a valid way of determining boss difficulty sincd it is such a widespread idea in the series.

          • Uhh… how old where you when you played TP and how old were you when you played SS?

            TP was released in 2006
            SS was released in 2011

            Arguably you were 5 years older and 5 years smarter after playing more Zelda games. You were more wise to Zelda conventions and Zelda enemies weak points. So naturally of course, TP should’ve given you more trouble, since you played it before SS.

            I mean compare yourself to me. I’ve been playing Zelda games since the NES. The last time I died to a boss was on the SNES. By the time Ocarina of Time came around, I have not died in a single boss battle EVER. So personally I weight the difficulty of bosses on the evidence presented to me. Things like how much damage bosses do, the amount of thinking I have to do to beat a boss, the complexity of the combat compared to other games.

            Overall there is simply more complexity to SS’s bosses. And overall the bosses require you to do more damage to them. There isn’t much in the way of shortcuts, like say TP. Which are embarrassing difficulty wise. Even from a damage taken aspect, to AI aspect, to just how OP you as LInk are in TP.

          • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

            I was 15 when TP released, which is younger, but I still feel like that’s old enough to be pretty okay at games, especially after having played many before that. I started playing Zelda in the mid 90s sometime with Link’s Awakening, and before TP released I got so into Zelda that I went back and played every game I missed, beating all of them but Zelda 2. That in mind, I also do not think that the difference of playing Twilight Princess alone is enough to make me so much smarter by comparison that SS becomes easier.

            You keep saying they were more complex, but I don’t see it. They had similar mechanics in SS to every other Zelda game, and were at least as guilty of following series cliches, as we have already been over. TPs bosses were not incredibly complex, all things considered, but how were those in SS any better?

    • Jesiah Grant

      Bruh Koloctos was legiiiiiiiit! Was hoping for bosses like that in BoTW…

  • Kaine Morrison

    Uhm… Link was able to jump in Zelda II. It certainly wasn’t 30 years!

    • Sean Michael-Patrick Thompson

      So to rephrase his sentiment correctly, “It took 30 years for Link to learn how to jump in a game that was good.”

      • Tenshi-Ruya

        Zelda II is far from a bad game. Sure it wasn’t a typical Zelda game, but it was still a good game in its own right.

        • Nick Collins

          Exactly, Tenshi-Ruya. Zelda II isn’t a bad game at all. It’s completely beatable. Hard, but beatable. And it is certainly a stray from what everyone loves about Zelda games, but it’s a darn good one. I highly recommend to almost ANYONE who complains about that game from their youth to revisit it. I did, and fell in love with it.

      • Kaine Morrison

        Zelda 2 was a really good game!

  • Other games haven’t gotten a free pass because they were zelda. at least from fans you will find a lot of people hating on some games more than others e.g. skyward sword. but despite what is missing from botw the fans seem to still love it. Reviewers should be less biased than the fans so the reviews should be even better.

    there was a lot of major things nintendo could have easily put in that are missing from botw that would have made it a 10/10 game.
    e.g. exploring caves, some world-embedded dungeons (maybe with the no-loading screen such as when you enter someones house), a lot more awesome enemies from past games could have returned, fishing rods and a better final boss or form of ganon. Plus some timeline explanation would have been nice but really not important.

    But despite all that the games uniqueness and what is in the game is still good enough to put it to between a 9 and 8 out of 10 imo

  • Rinku

    For me this kind of debates about if a game is overrated or not always were very childish ones. Turning around the morbidity instead of around the game itself.

    Now, the question: Did Breath of the wild get a free pass because it was Zelda. For me, the answer is no. The game is great in terms of quality and design, and clearly got the apreciation from the press for it. If it were not good enough, it would have the same reception like previous Zelda titles, even with some big journal like Gamespot criticizing Skyward sword and rating it with a 7. Press showed in a lot of situiations that tehy’re not afraid about punishing big franchises. The problem with all this is that, for some reason, exist some people upset about the reception of the game. Not with the game itself. They don’t care the game at all. Upset about having to read that BOTW is so good.

    That said, is not a perfect game. Perfect games don’t and never will exist. And like with all games, all the praising doesn’t protect the game about proper criticism. But clearly deserves the reception that it had. More than any Zelda title since Majora’s mask.

    • Jesiah Grant

      Perfect game = Metal Gear solid 3 🙂

      • Juan Gabriel Martinez Rodrique

        That game was awesome, but a bit short.

        • Jesiah Grant

          None the less awesome, rather a shorter game then a overly drawn out for no reason game. MGS3 was precis, prefect and one hell of a good ride.

          • Juan Gabriel Martinez Rodrique

            Your right on that point, but I would have like extra content like the VR missions in MGS2 substance. In terms of story and gameplay MGS3 subsistence is the best. In terms of content Substance is the best example. But thats in my opinion. anyways if we where to take and example of a perfect game in its genre MGS3 is a darn good candidate.

          • Jesiah Grant

            We did get those 2 classic Metal Gear games on the MGS3 subsistence disk 🙂 that’s a bit of extra content too hehe

          • Juan Gabriel Martinez Rodrique

            Oh yeah!!! I totally Forgot about those, those were awesome! but the Extra content of Substance was better for me because it used the 3d engine and allow for new gameplay experiences. MGS games are almost always somewhat short, and you don’t get to utilize all the tools you have at your disposal. the VR missions gave you space for that. The extra games allow people to familiarize better with the MGS lore and the VR allow you to experience MGS gameplay in new ways. Anyways both are good games and we agree that MGS3 edges out MGS2!

          • Jesiah Grant

            Totally agree, MGS3 was my first exposure to metal gear and I’m so glad because thats actually the first one chronologically int he timeline so nothing was confusing hahah 😀

          • You missed putting an emoticon in this comment. Yw.

  • Barren*
    Literally unreadable 2outtaten

  • Anonymous

    Reading these comments only solidifies one thing:

    The Zelda cycle is alive and well. Lol.

    • David García Abril

      Not really. The cycle includes the previous main entry being vindicated, and that hasn’t happened to “Skyward Sword”. Far from it.

      • K2L

        If anything, SS is more hated now than before by those who liked BOTW. And those who didn’t like either game are more likely to move on from the series altogether.

        Maybe some people just need to move on from the series altogether.

        • Dragonmaster 150

          I dunno, I actually ike both SS and BotW. yes SS is frustratingly linear at times, but I think that it has a really good story and I never really had any of the motion control problems that other people seem to have.

          I also enjoyed BotW; the art style is beautiful, I actually found many of the NPC’s to be unique and memorable, though I wish that they had done more with the story and development of the main supporting characters (the champions, the king, etc.) and I wish the dungeons were a bit longer and the dungeon bosses harder. when it comes to frame rate and frame drops I’ve never really had any issues playing on my Wii U. Sure it gets a little choppy in towns (or it used to before the 1.2 update), and fighting mobiles can, for whatever reason, sometimes cause some annoying frame lag. aside from that though it’s never bothered me in the slightest.

          All in all I had fun playing both games and that is what I think truly matters. Because “if it isn’t fun why bother?” – Reggie Fils Amie 2017

    • LittleGreen

      Why does this term exist? Zelda fans are more than one person and a series’ community can have varying and changing opinions on a game. It’s literally nothing new.

    • I swear that Zelda Informer is a deliberate instigator of the Zelda cycle. I mean look at the topics that seem to repeat on here since the release of BotW. It’s all the same discussion just regurgitated over and over again, and it’s usually all spun with negative flair.

      When Skyward Sword was released they would complain “Zelda stale, and boring, rehashed themes for dungeons”. Or “Same old formula, get three things, than get Master Sword, then get 3-5 more things, then fight Ganon”. Or “Story is too simple, no plot twists, needs JRPG plot twists”.

      A Zelda game could literally give fans all they’ve been asking for and it wouldn’t be enough. There would still be something wrong with it.

    • BOTW has real flaws though, and deserves to be tore to shreds, while SS is still severely underappreciated.

  • Tanaka

    I think that the game has an only big failure : the lack of various enemies. This game has the biggest world map ever for the Zelda franchise, and there are 30 enemies…..it’s awful. For a game which is inspired by the first Zelda , that’not enough. When i saw for the first time the Hinox and the Lynel ..it was amazing…But where is Gohma ? Where is like like ? Where are Gibdos? Where are the leevers ? Where are the Peahats ? Where are the River Zora ? Where are the Wallmaster ? Where the Goriyas ? Darknuts ? Etc….. Where the enemies which makes a true big adventure ? For a big game like Botw , it’s disappointing. ( i’ m sorry for my english abilities , i’m a french-frog) . It’s the same problem since WW , the world is too big …and empty.

    • Coqui421

      Gohma, darknuts and wall master only ever appear inside dungeons and this game doesn’t have classic dungeons with enemies in them. River zora and sea zora have never appeared in the same game, goriyas have only appeared in 2D Zelda games and maybe like likes just didn’t fit in with the art style and/or mechanics of the game. I can’t think of a reason for peahats being left out tho that is disappointing. Leevers also seem like a big oversight but I hate them so it doesn’t bother me. Gibdos and/or redeads probably should’ve returned also.

      • Tanaka

        Why don’t make those monsters in overworld ? Hinox are mid-bosses in LA , aren’t ? I think that the idea of more monsters in this game , could have made a stronger principle of immersion . For exemple , in zoonai ruins you can see a new background different from the great plateau ( a kind of jungle) ok ? I expected find a unic species for this place ( peahats?), to make a “mark” , to make the zone “unic”, Link could have been like an explorer discovering a new fauna, in this BIG WORLD. Do you remember the place where is the only octoballoon in alttp ? It’s the same idea….

  • Zero

    I agree that Breath of the Wild is a great game, but I do not think it should have received so many perfect scores. It lacked so many aspects to be a great game, let alone a Zelda game:

    – HUMONGOUS open-world: So big, you can just explore for hours on end, but empty. With as much ground to cover as there is, going up mountains and floating through rivers to find Korok seeds or weapons gets old. It reminds me of the argument fans had over Twilight Princess about its world when it came out.
    As an additional note, 900 Korok seeds is crazy. This is because of my own personal preferences on how I approach Zelda games, but I am a completionist, and I find myself looking for details in the environment for seeds more than enjoying the scenery almost all of the time. I understand the merit of finding them all and probably spending the next 5 years doing it before the next Zelda game, but yeah… that Korok mask would be helpful.

    – Inventory space: I felt the breaking weapons mechanic was an interesting addition, but too many times I would be wary about using awesome weapons I would find to keep for “the final boss” only to run out of space because of this. Finding weapons, especially after about halfway through the story, wasn’t hard; it was having the space for the ones you liked vs. the most practical to use/keep.

    – Empty characters/plot: Keep in mind, the game took over 5 years to finalize. Yes, the mechanics in the game are on-point. I love playing the game, I love the combat, and the world is beautiful with unique features all around. However, I love character development too: fleshing out these characters to invest feeling into them or creating dynamic plots with interesting motives behind them. I did not feel this way with mostly all of the characters. Then compare that to Majora’s Mask (which yes, reused character models but only took a year to release after OoT), and I was pretty disappointed in BotW’s characters. The side-quests were empty fetch quests, and I only really felt any “connection” with the Zora people/champion.
    Although I am sure the DLC will improve this, at least as far as the champions are concerned, I do not feel I should spend a third of the game’s price to enjoy this.

    – Final boss accessibility: definitely my opinion of course, but I didn’t like that the final boss was accessible at the near-beginning of the game. It made the rest of the game seem kind of pointless. I actually almost beat Ganon before the first dungeon and had to reset to not spoil the fun of completing the game. Open worlds are cool, but not having limiters makes things seem kind of pointless, at least for the main plot line.

    – Small variety of enemies: I totally agree with Tanaka; the number of different enemies was disappointing. I fought so many bokoblins, lizalfos, and moblins it’s ridiculous. Lynels were amazing, but I would have liked to have seen more interesting enemies as well.
    I don’t know about anyone else, but I thought the bosses at the end of each dungeon were also lackluster at best and took no effort really, compared to a Lynel.

    – Frames/Second: … I don’t think I need to explain this one.

    Overall, it’s a fantastic game. I love the visuals and artwork, the gameplay is fantastic, and I have fun every time I pick it up for the most part. Different approaches to fighting enemies and solving puzzles was a big plus for me. However, there are times the game feels tedious and empty as well (and not just because it’s 100 years after the Calamity destroyed everything). And honestly, I miss the music. I like some of the stuff in the soundtrack and the light piano here and there, but nothing really defines itself anymore like many of the past soundtracks before. It definitely deserves a solid score, but I wouldn’t say a perfect one.

  • Sentinel

    Not trying to hate one bit but…I do believe it did get a pass on certain things just for being Zelda.

    Story in particular. There are other open-world games that have woven great exploration with pretty good storytelling. In my opinion, BotW’s story is an unfocused mess but I see many shove that aside for some dumb excuse like “you don’t play Zelda for the story”.

    Same with music. Other games did great with mixing large worlds and adventurous OST’s. BotW has minimalistic “noise” for an OST.

  • Juan Gabriel Martinez Rodrique

    I think it did get a pass, but I would rather say a review pass. The game scoring Perfects 10/10’s everywhere was to much. The game is perfect in the gameplay department, but falls apart in other areas. For instances the world can feel really empty at times and it doesn’t help that the music sucks. Its really lame to discover a cabin at the top of a mountain to then reach it listening to the monotone tunes of mother nature. then once you reach the cabin you discover that it is burn down and you probably only get a Korok seed if anything. Thats like half the game. The enemy selection feels limited, the AI is good and you do get a few scares with the guardians, but once you get one or two of the Champions abilities and figured out how to battle the guardians the lack of new enemies becomes bothersome. Where are the Darknuts, Tektites, or Poe’s? The story could have been ok with the voice acting and all, but has one massive fault. In fact the story and voice acting share that same fault, the lack of a compelling antagonist. I’d said this like a thousand times, but the lack of Ganondorf is possibly the worst dent in BotW. When you finally reach the Calamity theres no reasons for all the destruction, just a shallow boss fight with and ether cloud. And they actually did voice acting and forgot to put a voice in one of the most important characters. And to hammer the point further the last boss is way to easy unless you when there from the beginning. The lack of traditional dungeons is also bad, I mean I did like the concept behind the divine beast, but one or two dungeons would have been good.The quest also where a bit lame and lacked compelling rewards, but we couldn’t ask for more, after all what items are we going to receive after the developers removed iconic items like the hookshot or iron boots and just gave you the shiekah slate. And this is a minor thing , but it still bothers me, you loss the ability to attack vertically or diagonally with your weapons. Some of the cool stuff you find your not able to keep like the Stalhorses or Lord of the mountain. The weapon breaking system while neat is exaggerated. And to conclude some of the coolest Items you can have in game are hidden behind a amiibo. This is a solid game and I have mention only the bad, but you guys know the good things this game does, but to me this is more of a 8/10. Really hoping the DLC fixes some of this stuff.

    • Tanaka

      Well done, I agree. The Zelda series ‘bestiary is incredible. In this game ( the biggest world map ever in zelda) it’s dissapointing. The lack of enemies break the immersion. For exemple, an big Aquamentus sleeping in a cave , the only one in this game , have been pretty good ( for loot : Aquamentus’horn..lol ) For the music, i find the ost logic with this new univers ( miyazaki-like ) . But it’s true that an epic orchestral remix of the older “overworld” theme, should have been….cool ! Else, for the hookshot isn’t a problem, because the global gameplay don’t really need. But without iconics things, the developpers should have made more others iconics things to keep the Zelda’s soul….8/10 me too.

    • Vados

      The music sucks? The MUSIC SUCKS ????

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aWHkYWslcw This sucks???

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4aB4d0Cwag Or this???

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjTTZgfX2jA Or that ???

      https://youtu.be/2IJE8m8Ey24 What about this one??

      https://youtu.be/mETAEJY_rk8 This is a bad OST??? Really??

      Seriously how many of you people, who claim the soundtrack sucks, have actually listened to it? Just because the game uses more ambient sounds and tracks when you’re out in the field, doesn’t make the soundtrack bad.

      • David García Abril

        I wouldn’t say “it sucks”, since it fits the tone of the game. But it’s definitely not as memorable, nor as fitting to be listened on its own as other entries in the franchise. I mean, I loved hearing the music while galloping in BotW, but it’s not a music I’d listen on my phone on its own like I did with the Overworld themes of previous entries.

        There are a few that are great in that same way too, like the theme you just linked, but they are few and far in between.

        • Vados

          I dunno, I think it’s great to listen to on its own. I do that all the time when I’m learning…Majora’s Masks soundtrack on the other hand is somewhat awful at times for example (great bay coast…jesus…). And as iconic as the songs from OoT are, I think they are way too simplistic and repetitive. It’s easy to remember a song, if it’s just 3 notes that repeat each other.

          Wind Waker showcases the problem that Breath of the Wild avoids, imo. I think WW has one of the least memorable soundtracks in the franchise, simply because everything is overshadowed by the theme of the great sea, since you spend so much time there. BotW would’ve run into the same problem if it had actual field music.

          I don’t really know how they’d be able to include a more traditional soundtrack in an open world game tbh. Xenoblade Chronicles tried to do that, but after hearing the same song for hours, it just gets ridiculously annoying imo.

      • Juan Gabriel Martinez Rodrique

        Ok lets rectify it. The soundtrack is good, but how much do you hear it? I would say around a 80% to 85% of the time playing. It does have a legit Soundtrack, but your not hearing those tunes most of the time. The Devine beast sounds are only heard once, Hyrule castle is an isolate exception and molduga battles are few and also isolated in the desert. Most of the time your stuck with the bokoblins theme which grows stale over time and no sound at all. This is more about taste but I don’t like the BotW main theme that much, but having a small selection of playable music at the time can create hit and miss opportunities even if there is a great OST behind the game. And this point is also arbitrary and personal, but the soundtrack to me is sleep inducing. So to correct the previous comment The music experience has a high potential of sucking despite having a good OST.

  • MujuraNoKamen

    An amazing game no doubt but when you see all these people say it’s perhaps the greatest game ever it does seem a bit much – to me anyway.
    Gameplay systems were great, and it looks excellent but most notably he characters and story were really underwhelming. No character development at all, not much explanation to whats going on and the final boss is just wtf
    Dungeon were another weak element too, great that you could go them in any order great that they were laid out differently to what we’ve seen before but they were small and all themed pretty much the same, neither was distinct from the other (aside from the odd bit of directing water flow or using wind turbines – so much for straying from convention) also it kinda annoyed me that for a game with no hand holding you’d have someone tell you every time you did one of those terminals how many were left and where to go.
    Some said the world felt empty I can see where they’re coming from but I really liked it. all the open expanse is there to make you feel small and even if there’s no enemies or quests in certain areas there’s the ability to hunt, you have to brave the elements and find little korok seeds etc It captured the feeling of being out in the middle of nowhere really well imo.
    Overall it’s fantastic game and excelled at so many things but felt like a step back in others

  • Joshua Little

    It’s more likely that most reviewers probably never got off the plateau, they don’t get a lot of time before writing and that’s when the game was at it’s best. The reason there’s a lot of Zelda fans who don’t like this game is because it’s story is simply unsatisfying. The world is the story sounds really meta, but that’s not true. The story is disproportionately small compared to the large world map. This is just like how the side quests are overwhelmingly similar despite the diverse look of the world itself. If you had a good time with vistas and the physics in the game, that’s great, but it’s not the story in the game. It would be like saying you imagined a story for Asteroids, so now the game has a story; you may have enhanced your fun that way, but it’s not the actual story. I get what people like about it, but for a lot of Zelda fans, we never showed for the physics and pretty world; we wanted an epic story in a world full of history (not just familiar names). A story isn’t epic because of the size of the world map, it’s because of the story. This game may have all that you like, but it didn’t have a full and rewarding story, it had very few connections to the lore of the series. That’s why you see so many who don’t have nice things to say about it. It’s a decent game, just not a very good Zelda game.

    • Alex

      I sincerely love your response. I really didn’t like BOTW. I played for a week and a half straight, did all I could in the game and it really felt like more of a chore then an experience to me. Rather then open world with a story it felt more sandboxy and that’s great for people who love sandbox and enjoying the games gameplay and physics but I love Zelda for the lore and the story and the depth they give characters and I felt close to none of it throughout the entire game aside from the spare part here or there that really had my interest before the game wiped that slate clean and it was back to traversing a giant open world with not much motivation. The game was a great game granted, its just not what I wanted for a Zelda game and it fell a bit flat for someone searching for that zelda experience. I don’t think its the gameplay or style change either,

  • Zero

    I agree that Breath of the Wild is a great game, but I do not think it should have received so many perfect scores. It lacked so many aspects to be a great game, let alone a Zelda game:
    – HUMONGOUS open-world: So big, you can just explore for hours on end, but empty. With as much ground to cover as there is, going up mountains and floating through rivers to find Korok seeds or weapons gets old. It reminds me of the argument fans had over Twilight Princess about its world when it came out.
    As an additional note, 900 Korok seeds is crazy. This is because of my own personal preferences on how I approach Zelda games, but I am a completionist, and I find myself looking for details in the environment for seeds more than enjoying the scenery almost all of the time. I understand the merit of finding them all and probably spending the next 5 years doing it before the next Zelda game, but yeah… that Korok mask would be helpful.
    – Inventory space: I felt the breaking weapons mechanic was an interesting addition, but too many times I would be wary about using awesome weapons I would find to keep for “the final boss” only to run out of space because of this. Finding weapons, especially after about halfway through the story, wasn’t hard; it was having the space for the ones you liked vs. the most practical to use/keep.
    – Empty characters/plot: Keep in mind, the game took over 5 years to finalize. Yes, the mechanics in the game are on-point. I love playing the game, I love the combat, and the world is beautiful with unique features all around. However, I love character development too: fleshing out these characters to invest feeling into them or creating dynamic plots with interesting motives behind them. I did not feel this way with mostly all of the characters. Then compare that to Majora’s Mask (which yes, reused character models but only took a year to release after OoT), and I was pretty disappointed in BotW’s characters. The side-quests were empty fetch quests, and I only really felt any “connection” with the Zora people/champion.
    Although I am sure the DLC will improve this, at least as far as the champions are concerned, I do not feel I should spend a third of the game’s price to enjoy this.
    – Final boss accessibility: definitely my opinion of course, but I didn’t like that the final boss was accessible at the near-beginning of the game. It made the rest of the game seem kind of pointless. I actually almost beat Ganon before the first dungeon and had to reset to not spoil the fun of completing the game. Open worlds are cool, but not having limiters makes things seem kind of pointless, at least for the main plot line.
    – Small variety of enemies: I totally agree with Tanaka; the number of different enemies was disappointing. I fought so many bokoblins, lizalfos, and moblins it’s ridiculous. Lynels were amazing, but I would have liked to have seen more interesting enemies as well.
    I don’t know about anyone else, but I thought the bosses at the end of each dungeon were also lackluster at best and took no effort really, compared to a Lynel.
    – Frames/Second: … I don’t think I need to explain this one.
    Overall, it’s a fantastic game. I love the visuals and artwork, the gameplay is fantastic, and I have fun every time I pick it up for the most part. Different approaches to fighting enemies and solving puzzles was a big plus for me. However, there are times the game feels tedious and empty as well (and not just because it’s 100 years after the Calamity destroyed everything). And honestly, I miss the music. I like some of the stuff in the soundtrack and the light piano here and there, but nothing really defines itself anymore like many of the past soundtracks before. It definitely deserves a solid score, but I wouldn’t say a perfect one.

  • Zero

    Alright, why does my comment keep getting flagged as spam?

    • Parf McBarf

      Because the mods are sensitive nancies. I’ve had several comments removed in my time, many of which had no swearing in them.

      • Zero

        Seriously, I just gave an opinion of the game; I wouldn’t even say it was bad or good toward it! Both times marked as spam. So encouraging for readers/commentators! *in sarcastic tone*

        • Parf McBarf

          “Censorship is like telling a man he can’t have a steak, just because a baby can’t chew it.”
          -Mark Twain

          • Zero

            YES. Exactly. Could not have put it better Mr. Twain.

  • K2L

    “when it comes to it’s story, it’s dungeons, and it’s bosses”

    You’d do well with some proofread, Andy.

  • Did Breath of the Zelda get a free pass because it was “Zelda”?!

    That is the silliest thing. It’s funny when I see people make such a comment. Since when has a big name franchise ever got a pass for simply being it.

    Did Star Wars the Phantom Menace get a free pass for just being “Star Wars”? … lol nope
    Did Ghost Busters:Answer the Call get a free pass for just being “Ghostbusters”? … lol nope
    Did Indiana Jones: The Crystal Skull get a free pass? …. also a big nope

    Simply put when a video game series carries a huge brand name, that doesn’t mean it gets a free pass. Typically it’s quite the opposite. I mean ask Metroid Prime: Federation Force. It had the name Metroid Prime in it, people should’ve loved it right?! Even had the first person perspective. But quite the contrary, fans were absolutely and excessively disappointed in it’s very existence.

    If anything it’s more likely that fans and critics are going to be even more critical of the game if it doesn’t live up to the expectations of the franchise. If it doesn’t feel like it, or doesn’t meet their demands or wishes.

    Both Breath of the Wild and Skyward Sword were Zelda games. Both did different things, and ultimately overall one has been better received. It isn’t some fluke that Breath of the Wild garnered so many perfect scores. Breath of the Wild delivered a Zelda game that many fans, and critics actually wanted and ultimately it lived up to their expectations. If it hadn’t, you would’ve seen scores similar to Skyward Sword… which although it had quite a few high scores, is still the lowest scored console Zelda title so far.

  • Dragonmaster 150

    I neither agree nor disagree with your statement. All I know was that yes there were some improvements that could have been made, such as better character development, longer dungeons, tougher boss fights, etc. but for me the most important thing was that the game was fun. That’s the reason why we all play games isn’t it? because we enjoy *playing* them.

    We can argue until we’re blue in the face over what was good and what was bad: Oh there were there were frame drops you say? That automatically makes it a bad game? NO! What makes a game good or bad is whether it’s FUN or not. A game can have bad graphics and still be fun to play, a game can have horrible side-quests and still be enjoyable, a game can have bad character development, but if you’re having fun do you really care?

    I’m not saying these things aren’t important, far from it, but by far the most important thing, to me, that separates a good game from a bad game is how fun it is to play.

    “If it isn’t fun why bother?” – Reggie Fils-Amie, E3 2017

  • JoJo

    Honestly, I think people jumped the gun before assessing the game in a non-biased way. Of course, the game is amazing, but it DOES have flaws, and I think that if the reviews would have come out about a month after release, the scores would more accurate.

    While I think it needs more work, it is a great skeleton for the next Zelda game.

  • Hude

    It’s the same feeling Skyrim and Fallout 4 gave me. You walk around in an empty world until you run into a pack of enemies or a cave/building (shrine in this case). BotW is not for me. Other than being able to climb anything, if I’ve played an open world games before, I’ve played BotW.

  • I’d argue that the reviewers only really gave it such praise because of the fact that it’s “open world” which is so important for some reason nowadays.

    I’d honestly wish I knew that the game had garbage dungeons and a crap story before going out of my way to buy it.

  • SkyDrop123

    I agree completely. I think there was a lack of looking at Breath of The Wild as a game instead of a Zelda game.

  • I never believed a game would surpass GTAIV or Metal Gear Solid IV as the most overrated game ever. Boy i was wrong… Breath of the Wild is far more overrated than any other game prior to it. 97 on metacritic? This is laughable.

    Anyone who claims BotW deserves a 97 metascore, is either a 8 year old kid with no video game experience, a nintendo fanboy, or a liar. In a world where Witcher 3 came 2 full years prior to BotW and blows it out of the water, yet has a metascore of 91, giving BotW a 97 metascore is a disgrace.